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Wealth Formula Episode 237: Is Angel Investing Right for You?

Catch the full episode: https://www.wealthformula.com/podcast/237-is-angel-investing-right-for-you/
Buck: Welcome back to the show everyone today my guest on Wealth Formula Podcast is Tom Wallace. Tom is a 40 year veteran of technology startups both as a founder and an investor and, after multiple successful exits most recently selling vector learning for 268 million dollars, he's now the managing partner at Florida Funders which is a hybrid: a venture capital fund and angel investor network focused on finding funding and building the next generation of breakout technology companies in Florida. Tom welcome to Wealth Formula Podcast.
Tom: Buck thanks for having me on your show. I really appreciate it. It's an honor to be here and thanks for hosting.
Buck: Yeah of course. And you know why don't we start out you know this is a sort of a different area for us but why don't you just start out a little bit by talking about your background I know we mentioned that you've been a tech guy, for the most part, your professional life. Talk a little bit about that and you know how you ended up I guess from being on the front lines as maybe an actual startup guide ultimately on the angel investor side.
Tom: Yeah sure so I come from a blue-collar family. Neither of my parents graduated from high school. And so when I got out of college it was 1980 and if you think about that time it was kind of the dawning of the microcomputer or personal computer revolution and I worked for a couple of years for a Fortune 500 company Alcoa my father said it's the only real job I ever had and then at the age of 23 my best friend and I started our first company and we started a company in the personal computer space and had no idea what we were doing we were young we were green. Back then buck it wasn't like today where there's all these incubators and accelerators and all these mentors and so many people you can get help starting you know an entrepreneurship is such a you know a cool thing and such a hip thing back then it was something that not a lot of people were doing and I was like most of the kids I went to college with were looking to go work for IBM or some Fortune 500 company but it was really a special time and we got bit when you got bit by the entrepreneurial bug and if you think back every so often game-changing technology comes along and certainly the late 70s early 80s that was the case with a personal computer if you think about up until that time the only had access to computers were universities large corporations or pretty good sized companies and they were big computers they were expensive and they took a team of geeks to program them yeah that all changed in the late 70s with Apple and IBM introduced their first personal computer in 1981 and compact computer and all that and it really now every person every small business could have a computer and the software that came along with it from people like Bill Gates and Mitch Kapoor of Lotus123 that came along with it you didn't any longer have to be a programmer or geek to figure out how to use this. So we start our business and that was our first company. We exited that about eight years later got about 20 million in sales and then kind of been doing it ever since and an entrepreneur and on the field as is I kind of look at I've been the core I was the quarterback for many years and you know living the daily grind and fight of being an entrepreneur. And I like being on the sidelines at this point
Buck: Got it. So you know we talked a little bit offline about my audience and where you know I tend to be for the most part you know alternative asset investors who are looking for different things generally you know heavily in real estate and that sort of thing. So you know a lot of the nomenclature maybe for this area is going to be a little bit foreign maybe just from an educational standpoint maybe kind of if you would you know you hear a lot of different types of things, words thrown around like angel investing and venture capital and private equity within technology, can you talk a little bit about that and maybe you know kind of where you're focused.
Tom: Yeah sure so I kind of look at it in stages so early, early stage you know say Buck you were going to start a company a technology company tomorrow and you needed to raise a few hundred thousand dollars to get it going. The first thing you would probably do is go out to your family and friends and get them to invest so that's kind of very very early stage probably pre you probably don't have any revenue no customers it's just an idea. The next stage is angel investing and that's when you typically get a little bit past that family and friends maybe you've got some customers now you've got a real product you go out to that group and these are kind of and that and angels have changed over the years but you know many of us do it professionally so these are more sophisticated investors they do a lot of deals they see a lot of deals and we'll talk more about that later. Then if you're successful if your success continues you continue growing you get bigger now you're looking to in that angel round is typically maybe 500 000 to a million maybe a little more maybe a little less, now you're ready for you know a more institutional round or series a these rounds tend to be more like two to three million to 10 million amount amount that you're raising that's venture capital still early but you've got customers you've got some traction and then you know and that really from venture capital private equity is even later stage and the difference in and I spent the last kind of 10 years my career running private equity companies working a lot with private equity guys that's tend to be that tends to be later stage companies they're profitable they put a lot of leverage on them so the private equity companies typically put a lot of debt on these companies so there has to be that cash flow in ebitda to make that happen and so property equity guys are looking for two three four x returns on their companies maybe greater than when we exited vector solutions my last company. I take our last private equity round we provide our investors about eight or nine times their money back venture capital is different game they know they're gonna invest in and by the way private equity guys nothing's going to zero, they're not investing in companies that are going to zero. I mean once a while it happens but it's a rarity where venture capital is a little different game you know and it depends on where you're playing it because if you're playing in New York or Silicon Valley it's a different game than you're playing in Florida but typically we're banking on a certain percentage of our companies going to zero that they're just not going to be successful and you know some we're going to get our money back and we're going to make all our money on kind of the top third that's how we look at Florida Funders the third or third or third but you know the you know the folks out in the valley probably look at it more like you're investing in 10 companies nine are going to zero one's gonna be unicorn and they're gonna make all the returns on the one company. So you know it varies a little differently with you know where you're playing geographically and what you're doing but that kind of is how we look at that paradigm of you know stages of investing in venture capital versus private equity.
Buck: Obviously and you're talking about you you sort of alluded to it a little bit but you know if the tech private equity folks are looking to return you know I think what did you say you know maybe for up to eight three or four three times over a period of how long like a decade or something like that.
Tom: I mean the returns typically they invest in money over a period about three or four years and then the returns start coming in shortly after that and they're out by usually like 10 years right.
Buck: And then with angel, so what's the compelling element that you like and maybe investors should know about your space which is you know the angel investing which is really the earliest I mean after friends and family right so it's certainly the highest risk but yeah so what do you just like the asymmetric nature of that?
Tom: Well it's risk reward so yeah I will admit I personally am a little bit of a deal junkie but you don't have to be. If you look at some of the research, I would never suggest anybody that is you know as they look at their asset allocation across their investments that angel investing should be a large portion of it. It is for me because it's what I do for a living so maybe a chair 20 of my net worth but 10 whatever but typically it's a small sliver two three percent for an investor but if you do it right angel investing can and has historically outperformed every other asset class including venture capital and private equity that is research coming out of the Angel Capital Association Of America. So the problem is most people don't do angel investing correctly. We call this the 5 Ds of angel investing, so diversity, deal flow, due diligence, domain expertise and discipline. So the first mistake most angel investors make I use my brother as an example my brother's a very successful software CEO, he sold his last company for 1.6 billion dollars and I said to him one day Tim you know what about angel investing he said I've done that two or three times I went to zero that doesn't work. Well you really can't do it two to three times because the odds are against you you might as well go to the casino you really need to be up to build a portfolio a diversified portfolio like you have to in most investing, we say 10 to 15 companies you should invest in to really you know have enough diversity. Secondly is deal flow. How many deals do you look at to invest in each one again look at my brother I'm like Tim well how many deals did you look at to do these two or three deals he's like well he just looked at those two or three like you know it Florida Funders and vendor we'll look at 50 deals to do one. So we're highly selective and we're you know we like believe we're getting the best of the best. And then due diligence is how much research and digging in did you do in your process and a lot of research on this 20 plus hours is you know really what you should do to maximize your potential returns if Florida Funders every company we do we have more like 80 to 100 hours of due diligence and this is everything from digging into the the founders and their background their experience to talking to those early customers asking about the product, why they buy it, how important it is, is it nice to have, does it have to have we really get into in their technology, what's your technology stack look like, what's their IP, so that's a big part of it. And then domain expertise and this is investing in what you know. You're a doctor right you're a surgeon so if you were looking to invest in a medical device company you would know a lot more about that than me. So with us at 1000 Florida Funders we invest in software companies software as a service we invest in cyber security fintech edtech digital health areas that all of me and my partners have backgrounds in. So we're investing in what we know. And then the last thing is discipline to be a good investor I would argue real estate I don't know what you're guessing you gotta come up with your your thesis and you gotta stick to it. And the biggest thing we see in angel investing or I see an angel investigators mistake people make is fomo. They invest because all their friends are investing and they don't want to miss out on this deal that is not a good reason to invest and what we found is if you're disciplined and you follow those other four d's and that process and do that over and over again that you're going to be successful and that this can be a very not only successful asset class from a return on investment standpoint but also fun. I mean think about it we'd like to say we get to go to work every day with these young talented smart people who are trying to change the world we're gonna be more fun than that?
Buck: Yeah let's you know exploring some of those d's for a moment one of them I'm thinking about here is you mentioned deal flow and I now you're in Florida. If I'm you know a software developer and I've got something I'm excited about, am I gonna go to Silicon Valley or I mean so how does that factor into this in terms of affecting your deal flow? Do you see some advantages in being you know on the other coast or what's that been like in your experience?
Tom: Yeah we we do see some advantages in Florida is a very unique state we're the third most populous state in the country growing rapidly we have great tax laws we're a very pro state very unlike California in a lot of ways now again they play a different game it's really not California Silicon Valley In San Francisco right I mean by the way all the venture capital invests in the united states goes into 60 of it goes into four little micro markets. Twenty percent goes in Silicon Valley twenty percent san francisco ten percent boston ten percent in new york so forty percent goes to the rest of the world. We have in Florida over the last decade really great success stories and technology companies like Chewy.com, Jetsmart, Fanatics, Knowbe4, Connect-wise, these are all unicorn companies built here in Florida where the people the entrepreneurs didn't leave here to go to Silicon Valley they could have but they didn't and we're seeing more and more of that in fact we're seeing the opposite happen where we're getting calls from from founders are saying we're getting out of the valley we're getting out of San Francisco it's too expensive to the talent google and facebook are sucking up all the talent they pay them they we can't compete with them and we're looking for a pro business state to come to and in the past you know when that happened it was more it was mostly Austin Texas had benefited from that in colorado places like Boulder and Denver but now we're seeing it in Florida and it's exciting and you know we have a lot to offer these founders, we have 45 incubators and accelerators across the state, we have a lot of support systems for entrepreneurs and we're a very pro pro business state. So it's exciting. And then the other thing that's exciting from an investor standpoint is the valuations. You know companies in in Silicon Valley and San Francisco you know they're they don't have any revenues they have an idea and they're worth 10 million dollars you know in Florida most of the companies we invest in already have revenues already have customers somewhere you know the revenues might be 50 000 in annual recurring revenue up to maybe 500 000, but we can invest in them at a valuation of you know free market valuation maybe 5 million 3 million 7 million. So we don't need them to be a unicorn for us to have a very successful exit for us and for our fellow investors and we can get you know 10x 20x 30x returns with a company that's exiting at 100 million dollars which is in the tech world is not a huge exit today.
Buck: Tell me how it works in terms of a typical I mean my you know my listeners are used to you know the types of real estate private equity particularly our accredited investor groups and things like that but how does a fund like this work? Is it you know a typical 2 and 20 type type structure you know and if you could kind of talk about that and you know maybe also some historical in terms of what you're seeing you know obviously not promising anything future wise but what what kinds of results have you guys had?
Tom: Yeah so yes we're two and twenty our fund is a two and twenty fund so it's very typical.
Buck: So two percent annual basically under management and then twenty percent profit right and then right got it so that's pretty standard and then and then in terms of in Florida Funders what kind of you know structures are you looking at are are you doing? Are these regulation D exemption type things or I mean are they 506 c's or are they crowd funding or you know right crowdfunding or how are you structuring these?
Tom: Yeah so the way we work if we're a little different animal. We'd like to think we have a pretty unique model is once a company makes it through our vetting process and we say okay we're gonna invest in you. Our fund will put in the first, say we're gonna raise a million dollars for this company, our fund will put in 500 000 and then we take the 500 000 we go out to our crowd curated accredited investors we only deal with accredited so we're 506 C and then the crowd will fill in the rest, sometimes it's a little light maybe the fun will make up the distance many times it's over subscribed it will raise more for the founder or we'll just shut it off. So you know again we're a little a little bit different.
Buck: Sorry to interrupt but you're saying that each opportunity you're doing separately, you're not doing it as a portfolio like a fund, you're doing each business separately?
Tom: So we have two things we have a fund of our own that many of our just invest in the fund and we invest the money for them, but then we have this curated crowd of accredited investors who invest alongside our fund. So like myself personally I'm an investor in our fund I invest in almost every deal we do as well and I'll vary what I put in the deals based on what I think what I like you know that's that sort of thing. Now we have some many investors that are just in our fund they love what we're doing they're really excited about they're like you know hey we don't know technology, I don't know technology, I don't have time to look at even though you guys do all the due diligence and put it off on the portal and I don't really have to do a lot of work you kind of take the heavy lifting out of angel investing for me, I don't have the time to do it or I don't know tech so why don't I just give you the money and you guys invest it for me. And so we're on our second fund to go back to your question about our returns we're just stamming our first exits from our first fund which is about four years old. We had we'll have we've had two in the last week and one was 1.8 x times your money back and one was a little over two so those are moderate returns in our world yeah and we're playing you know we're we we expect to have some of those but we also expect to have 10x 20x 30x deals and then we expect to have zeros too.
Buck: Right got it. In terms of right now in this day and age specifically talking about a recessionary environment, a pandemic environment, how is this all affecting your business and you know your business is that you invest in you know capital all of these things.
Tom: Yeah it's been interesting because you know if you look back at 2009 2010 the great recession, the one area of investing that really never slowed and took was was early stage tech investing in an angel investing. It didn't really have much of an effect on it. We're kind of seeing that we're still doing deals we're very active or you know lots of deal flow you know some of our portfolio companies were severely affected by cobit but with the PPP loans and we work with our companies we don't just invest in them and leave them alone we take a board seat we get involved we coach them we provide introductions to them we help them in any way we can be successful. Many of them got ppp loans that are going to be forgiven or you know that really helped them a lot some of them pivoted and most of them have really bounced. We lost one there was a restaurant tech company which you know obviously that's not the space you want to be in this downturn in overdays but they weren't doing so great anyway. But a lot you know some you know some of our companies are k-12 education companies most of them have really bounced back now I mean they took a hit but they bounced back. We have companies in the healthcare space that you know they're involved a lot with elective surgery, they obviously took a hit but now they've bounced back. So it's been interesting it's been on you know we we hunkered down there with our companies for a while and said hey our message to them was cut your burn preserve cash you don't know when you're gonna be able to raise money again extend your runway and make sure you can live the fight your way through this and most of them have done that very successfully.
Buck: Where does for for your typical investor and I think you kind of had mentioned a little bit in terms of allocation, but you know if you look at a portfolio of you know 100 of your investable assets, what sort of a rule of thumb people I'm maybe not you know Tom Wallaces the world where you're in the middle of this but if you're looking to get exposure what what do you tell people what is sort of the rule of thumb on these types of things whether it be you know direct technology investments or angel investments or how do you look at or how do you suggest people look at it?
Tom: You know I think it's five percent or less you know whatever you're comfortable with but you know. There's something that's happened out there if you think about technology the days of buying amazon and apple and a couple hundred million dollar valuation rounding that to a trillion dollars or over. Facebook went public the valuation was what 70 billion. Uber went public valuation 40 50 billion. These companies because there's so much venture capital money out there these companies are waiting so long to go public to really get phenomenal returns angel investing is how you're going to do it because you know again companies are waiting so long to go public and so we you know again if you do the five Ds and you diversify you know there there's an opportunity for for great returns here and you know we're only seeing that trend more and more and it's becoming more exciting with all the changes to crowdfunding and all the rules that came out in you know when crowdfunding was first made legal back within six or seven years now so yeah it's an exciting space and it can be one again that you can have a lot of fun with and you can really see some exciting companies and meet some crazy founders great founders a tad crazy yeah and but yeah I'd say five percent or less I mean that's typically what our number would be.
Buck: So before we go maybe just sort of in general like for Florida Funders that's what it's called and what's the website
Tom: Floridafunders.com
Buck: So if you kind of gave us you know your you know your elevator pitch so to speak on on Florida Funders and why to look into it more and how you're different from the other angel groups what would you say to that?
Tom: Our secret sauce has a couple things. One is deal flow we've been named by cb insights and pitch book both those organizations says the most active EC in the southeast the most active venture capitalist in Florida. So we are out and about in the tech community down here, we're very well known. Every month 50 to 100 companies just go to our website and apply for funding. So we're looking at way more deals and as a result we think we're getting access to the best deals. The second part of our secret sauce is the extensive extensive due diligence we do, even more we invest alongside some Silicon Valley venture capitalists some New York venture capitalists and we often have co-investors in our deal and I would argue that almost nobody does the level of due diligence we do and that's everything from really getting to know the founders a lot of this is betting on the jockey to you know those early customers and interviewing them to plugging in a subject matter expert and we tap into our network of 1500 investors and you know we're looking at a health tech digital play you know we're pulling people that have extensive domain expertise who can really work in that space who have years of experience and they really help us evaluate these deals and once we invest they help these companies advise them and mentor them and coach them. So that's kind of what makes us different here at Florida Funders and if you think about you know where the future is for so many states, and obviously you know we're focused on Florida. We like to say we're we're looking to change Florida from a state we want Florida to be as known if not no more for technology and innovation than we are today for the mouse and tourism and strawberries.
Buck: Sure got it. Well listen Tom it's been great and very helpful and educational for my audience here. Again it's Florida Funders like fun having funders dot com Floridafunders.com and Tom I wanna thank you again for being on the show and maybe have you on again sometime and let us know how your next fund does.
Tom: Will do Buck it's been my pleasure. Thank you so much. All the best to you and your listeners and I've really enjoyed spending this time with you.
Buck: We'll be right back.
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Today Shows : August 13

beep.
day in history lookup
Grateful Dead - 1966/8/13 - Fillmore Auditorium, San Francisco, CA | No setlist. Mentions: 0
Grateful Dead - 1967/8/13 - West Park, Ann Arbor, MI | No setlist. Mentions: 0
Grateful Dead - 1975/8/13 - Great American Music Hall, San Francisco, CA | Set 1: Help on the Way, Slipknot!, Franklin's Tower, The Music Never Stopped, It Must Have Been the Roses, Eyes of the World, Drums, King Solomon's Marbles | Set 2: Around and Around, Sugaree, Big River, Crazy Fingers, Drums, The Other One, Sage and Spirit, Going Down the Road Feelin' Bad, U.S. Blues, Blues for Allah Mentions: 286 (#12) First: The Music Never Stopped (235), Sage and Spirit (2), King Solomon's Marbles (only)
Grateful Dead - 1979/8/13 - McNichols Sports Arena, Denver, CO | Set 1: Shakedown Street, Me and My Uncle, Big River, Candyman, El Paso, Friend of the Devil, Minglewood Blues, Althea, Lost Sailor, Deal | Set 2: I Need a Miracle, Bertha, Good Lovin', He's Gone, The Other One, Drums, Wharf Rat, Truckin' | Encore: Sugar Magnolia Mentions: 7
Jerry Garcia Band - 1984/8/13 - Club Casino, Hampton Beach, NH | Set 1: Cats Under the Stars, Knockin' on Heaven's Door, I Second That Emotion, Mississippi Moon, Tangled Up in Blue | Set 2: Sugaree, Run for the Roses, Get Out of My Life Woman, Midnight Moonlight | Encore: Rhapsody in Red
Grateful Dead - 1987/8/13 - Red Rocks Amphitheatre, Morrison, CO | Set 1: Big Boss Man, Jack Straw, Row Jimmy, It's All Over Now, Loser, Cassidy, Far From Me, Box of Rain | Set 2: Uncle John's Band, Estimated Prophet, He's Gone, Drums, Space, The Wheel, Gimme Some Lovin', Stella Blue, Throwing Stones, Not Fade Away | Encore: Not Fade Away, Touch of Grey, Knockin' on Heaven's Door Mentions: 6
Grateful Dead - 1991/8/13 - Cal Expo Amphitheatre, Sacramento, CA | Set 1: Picasso Moon, Sugaree, Walkin' Blues, Candyman, Stuck Inside of Mobile With the Memphis Blues Again, High Time, Let It Grow | Set 2: Foolish Heart, Saint of Circumstance, Eyes of the World, Drums, Space, All Along the Watchtower, Black Peter, Sugar Magnolia | Encore: Black Muddy River Mentions: 3
Jerry Garcia Band - 1994/8/13 - The Warfield, San Francisco, CA | Set 1: Cats Under the Stars, Stop That Train, Dear Prudence, Mission in the Rain, I Shall Be Released, My Sisters and Brothers, Deal | Set 2: The Harder They Come, Like a Road, Think, Russian Lullaby, Don't Let Go, The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down, Midnight Moonlight
1995/8/13 - Jerry Garcia is celebrated by family and 25,000 friends in Golden Gate Park
Today Show Playlist
other stuff:
Robert Hunter Songs Tags: Garcia | Weir | Pigpen | Brent | Phil | Pig & Brent | Dylan | R&B | C&W | Rarities | Jam
Shakedown | Scarlet / Sometimes Fire | Eyes | Bird Song | Pigpen | Random Dark Star Radio | 73 > 74 | Brent Era
Popularity by Era
Top Performances Roll Bones Song Mood?
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Colorado breweries we've visited in the rest of the state: 2020 update

One more roundup before we leave, alas. Regions are still super approximate. I updated some previous rankings as well.
Tallies: 137 in the Denver metro; 66 in the rest of the Front Range; 33 in the rest of the state. We've visited a total of 236 breweries, cideries, and meaderies in Colorado.

The Rest of the Front Range

The Rest of Colorado (South, West, Central)

Current category tally: 33
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Interview with playing card manipulator and magician Jeff McBride

Interview with playing card manipulator and magician Jeff McBride
WHO IS JEFF MCBRIDE?
Chances are you are reading this article because you already have some interest in playing cards. So maybe you've already heard of the name Jeff McBride. If you have, you'll already be familiar with his credentials, so you'll be itching to get straight the good stuff and read what he's got to say, because you know it's going to be worth reading.
But if you haven't heard of Jeff McBride before, let me tell you why this interview is a must-read: ● Are you into card magic? Jeff has been doing card magic his whole life, and is one of the very best in the world at card manipulation and sleight of hand. He has also been running his famous Magic & Mystery School for over 30 years. ● Are you into cardistry? Jeff's instructional Art of Card Manipulation videos were some of the foundational materials that shaped fathers of the cardistry movement like Dan and Dave Buck. Card manipulation is his speciality, and if there's anyone that we can learn a thing or two about card handling from, it's him. ● Are you into card collecting? Jeff's entire career has been built with a deck of cards in his hands, and he also collects some playing card memorabilia himself.
So if you are a playing card enthusiast in any way, this is a wonderful opportunity to learn from one of the greatest living card men. We were delighted when Jeff agreed to do this interview with us, and couldn't wait to hear some of his thoughts about various topics relating to his own career with playing cards. We even got opportunity to visit him at his own place, and take some photos of his memorabilia and more, which we have permission to show our readers for the first time! But first let's share some of his credentials, so that we can appreciate what he has to say in the context of his own accomplishments and achievements.

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Jeff McBride the Performer
Jeff McBride has had a love for magic that goes back to his childhood in New York's Catskill mountains, where he grew up. As a young boy he stumbled across The Golden Book of Magic in a library, which quickly became his first magic Bible. He performed gigs locally, did street performances, and eventually moved to Las Vegas, where he successfully built a career in magic, and performs his award-winning stage magic and runs a magic school.
His performance style is highly praised for its unique blend of traditional magic with a form of Japanese theater called kabuki. Drawing on an unusual mix of skills that includes martial arts, philosophy, and more, Jeff's stage act combines an unorthodox blend of sleight of hand with masks and mime, to create a unique show like no other. Besides his "home" stage in Las Vegas, he's performed on stages and in theaters around the world, including touring with The Illusionists. A Jeff McBride show never fails to showcase his dynamic, innovative, and creative personality, from someone who has proven himself over time to be a master entertainer, showman, and sleight-of-hand artist.
Jeff McBride's list of awards is too lengthy to cover all of them. But to mention just a few, he's received recognition from exclusive and respected organizations, including "Magician of the Year" by The Magic Castle's The Academy of Magic Arts and "Magician of the Year" by the Society of American Magicians. In 2018 the International F?d?ration Internationale des Societes Magiques (FISM) gave him their "Theory & Philosophy Special Award", in tribute for his lifetime contribution to magic from a viewpoint that is analytical and academic. This illustrious award has previously been given only to Tommy Wonder, Juan Tamariz, Eugene Burger, and Roberto Giobbi. Most recently in January 2020 he was inducted into the prestigious Hall of Fame by the Society of American Magicians. He is part of a very small group of living magicians that are part of this exclusive club, which includes David Copperfield and Siegfried and Roy. He's even the holder of three world records - don't worry, we'll be sure to ask him about that in our interview!
And of course he has appeared on television many times, already back in 1995 as part of the "World's Greatest Magic, and more recently on shows like Masters of Illusion, Criss Angel's Mindfreak, and Penn & Teller's Fool Us. But he's not just "another magician", as his selection as a judge for the 2008 reality celebrity-magic show Celebradabra confirms. Already more than ten years ago filmmakers produced a documentary about him, entitled Jeff McBride: A Magickal Life. This has been highly praised by magicians and viewers for how it shows his journey from a boy magician to a headline act in Las Vegas, and also his personal spiritual journey and development from a brash young man into a mature and caring magician who is keen to pass on the art of magic to the next generation. He really is one of the best.
Jeff McBride the Teacher
While the first part of his career was all about performing in his inimitable style, as the years have passed Jeff McBride has more and more mellowed into a highly respected teacher, with a keen interest in sharing his wisdom with others, and helping young magicians develop their skills in magic. Besides many written works, he's produced best-selling and highly influential instructional videos on the art of card manipulation, and on stage magic. His current passion is to serve as a sage that helps other magicians make their dreams as performers come true.
Perhaps his crowning achievement and lasting legacy is the McBride Magic & Mystery School, which he established in 1991. This is a world-renowned training ground for stage magic, and is generally regarded as the very best and most prestigious institution in the world for receiving magic instruction. There's simply no better place for aspiring magicians to go, in order to take seminars, classes, and workshops, to help raise their magic to a higher level, and to learn the true secrets of the craft.
Highly respected magician and lecturer Eugene Burger (pictured below with Jeff McBride) served as Dean of this school until his sad passing in 2017. It was from him that Jeff learned the importance of burning one end of your own candle in order to light someone else's candle. Many leading magicians have served on the faculty or as guest instructors, including big names like Lance Burton, Johnny Thompson, and Max Maven.
Jeff McBride is a wonderful entertainer himself, but his current passion is to be a mentor to others, and he will leave a lasting stamp in the lives of many magicians of the future. But now it's time for us to sit at his feet, and learn a thing or two from his life, and about his experiences with playing cards in particular.

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THE INTERVIEW
GENERAL BACKGROUND
For those who don't know anything about you, what can you tell us about yourself and your background?
I started my career with a pack of playing cards. Now I headline Las Vegas shows, and theaters and festivals all over the world. I also run a very successful magic school in Las Vegas, and I teach online.
I am one of the first magic teachers to create a video series, and my breakthrough videos on card manipulation taught the world how to perform flourishes and card manipulation, which happened to grow into a new cardistry movement. I was fortunate enough to train with great old-school masters and I put out The Art of Card Manipulation which caught on in Asia. The material contained within those DVDs - they were VHS videos at that time - did not need words to understand how to perform the magic, so they had international appeal. Many people like An Ha Lim and leading Asian manipulators found these, and my videos were their original training tools.
What would be some of the highlights in your career in magic?
Performing at Radio City Music Hall, the largest theater in the world with no screen support, no image magnification, and performing my card manipulation routine. The only other person that had that experience was Cardini. That was one of the highlights.
And of course, being inducted into the Society of American Magicians Hall of Fame. Also winning the FISM Special Award for Theory and Philosophy was a highlight. That's an award I share with Tommy Wonder, Juan Tamariz, and Eugene Burger.
How would you describe the style of the amazing act that you are known for?
I call it "sorcerer" style, which is very fiery and dynamic. There are many types of card routines, and mine is very explosive and dynamic. In fact during my touring seasons with the hit show The Illusionists, the closing number of the show was my card routine, just before the snow storm sequence. So my card routine can fill a giant theater. At that time of The Illusionists we were working a 7,000 seat theater. So my motto was "pack small, play big."
What were your major influences for this style of performance?
My influences came from many directions. I realized early on that performing standard magic was not a path to success. It was a path to working weddings, bar mitzvahs and birthday parties. In order to break out, I had to become a much more dynamic performer and I added other skillsets I had studied, like classic pantomime theater, which I'd studied at the American Mime Theater. I combined martial arts and my passion for masks and quick change, and dance. And it was this fusion of all of these different theatrical elements that made a huge difference. It was much more than magic, it was a total theatrical experience.
Where can people go to see you perform today?
I teach magic on a platform called MagicFlix. There's performances and tutorials. It's the world's leading streaming platform for magic. So you can immediately see me there. If you want to trial it, all you have to do is go to MagicFlix's website, enter your information, and put in the code MCBRIDE, and you can get 30 days for free. You can see not only myself, but the great masters of magic, and some of the great card magicians in history, as well as learn my card manipulation sequences.
Also if you want to see my live shows, I perform in Las Vegas at Wonderground, which is the longest running independent variety magic show in the history of Las Vegas. It is not attached to a casino, so we can do some pretty wild stuff! That's been running 11 years, and has hosted more variety entertainers on its stage than any other stage in Las Vegas.
What should we know about the McBride Magic & Mystery School, which has now been running for around 30 years?
It's now over 30 years. The McBride Magic and Mystery School came out of a great desire to study with masters. The challenge I see these days is that most people are learning magic from their peers, from people in their own age group. And not necessarily looking up the ladder at masters that have achieved great amounts of success.
So what I did 30 years ago, is I decided to host a retreat for masters to come and teach hungry students, mostly professionals, that were willing to empty their cup and fill up on wisdom and on the experience of great masters. And over the years we've had Eugene Burger, Johnny Thompson, Max Maven and many, many other masters come to the school to help our students understand the path to mastery. So not just learning from your pals online or at magic class, but really top-down training from experts in the field.
What are some of your interests outside of magic?
I spend a lot of time going to other conferences learning more skills on how to facilitate life-transforming experiences. So I spend a lot of time still studying how to teach more effectively, both in person and online.

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PLAYING CARDS & CARD MANIPULATION
You have set several Guinness World Records. What can you tell us about these?
I have three Guinness World Records, two of them for coin rolling, and one of them for card spinning. My Guinness World Record certificate states that I was able to "single handedly spin or scale a record of 106 playing cards within 60 seconds." That was set in 2004 for speed, for card throwing.
You are known for your skill in card manipulation. How would you distinguish magic from cardistry?
When they're fused together, they're indistinguishable, because of the flow state. Here are some flourishes, here are some card tricks - I think it can be seamlessly blended together. When I watch young cardists out there, I'm just amazed by the things that I see them doing these days. I'm totally delighted, and it's magical for me. Magicians that call cardistry "juggling" are just not getting what it's about. It's about entering a flow state, mastering these series of moves, and then pushing the envelope, until you have many of these different flourishes that you can string together seamlessly. That's the elegance of it.
What is one piece of work you have released that you'd like to be remembered by, or which might be of interest to the playing card enthusiast?
Anybody that watches Jeff McBride The Art of Card Manipulation will see how I researched all of the old school material and the stuff that I'd learned in my generation, and put it all together in one place. Those are the videos that the Buck twins - Dave and Dan - saw. Many of the people that first started card manipulation and cardistry saw me on those World's Greatest Magic specials back in the '90s that were filmed at Caesar's Palace. This was one of the first modern versions of card manipulation on TV.
So I think my series on The Art of Card Manipulation imprinted a lot of young magicians, young card handlers, and then the cardistry movement. I was not singularly responsible for that, but The Art of Card Manipulation was definitely essential fuel for it, because it was the most comprehensive card manipulation series ever put out.

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What advice would you give to a young person just starting to learn card magic or card manipulation?
Learn from your pals, but study in person with a great master. It will shave years off your learning curve.
Do you have any thoughts about the current boom in cardistry, and how this has become immensely popular in recent years?
The deck of cards is a great equalizer, isn't it? Here you have 52 objects, and now all you have to do is add your creativity and countless hours of practice and commitment to perfection. It's not like you can buy it. Acquiring the next magic illusion is quite different than acquiring the next impossible flourish with cards. You just can't do it, it has to come from the heart and soul. That's why I think cardistry became such a phenomenon. It doesn't have any language barriers, cultural barriers, or status barriers. All that separates one from being average or great is the commitment to perfection, artistry, and beauty.
What brand/type playing cards did you first use when you started magic and card manipulation?
I used every card I could get my hands on. There were bridge-size decks for card fanning that would have four different colors or four different patterns, so you could get the different color fans out of them. Really good fanning decks are sorely lacking today; I very rarely see any of these new decks being good fanning decks. But I would collect every thin card I could possibly find at that time. Very few people at that time were making flesh colored cards. Sometimes you had to strip cards down, and then paint them flesh colored, and use lots of powder to make them fan again.
Early on I used Crusaders, because in my teens that's what Jeff Sheridan was using, so I used Crusaders that you could get at Woolworth's. Bee cards are okay, but when they reach a certain age they just crack. A lot of the `old school' used and swore by the old Denver Plaids and the old Steamboats. So when I was in my tens and early teens (11-15 years old), there was a lot of Steamboats, and in my later teens I used Crusaders.
What brand/type playing cards do you mostly use today?
I switched over to my own brand, when I had my own cards printed by Phoenix (my cards are available on my site here). Phoenix really pays attention to their cutting and I'm very fond of Phoenix brand cards published by Christian Schenk from Card-Shark.
What do you think are the essential qualities of a good deck of playing cards?
The ability to fan them out of the pack, and their ability to faro shuffle. Those are the two prime ingredients. That they don't need fanning powder. That they're not too slippery, so you don't have to work with them too long to get the finish off, and that they faro well. I'm mostly a stage performer, and I do close up as well. I love some of the decks that you have, with the very whimsical face designs. But for me it's the way the cards handle more than the way they look.
Has the quality of playing cards has improved over the years?
Oh, absolutely. Absolutely the quality has improved over the years. The finishes these days and the deck designs are just incredible.

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What are your thoughts on the explosion of custom playing cards that we are seeing today?
For me personally, I don't see enough nice fanning decks. I would collect them, but they're not out there.
I think the next step for card collectors is: how do you store and display them? The serious person will start to make floor to ceiling displays for walls of cards with a giant ladder, like a library so you can have these decks on display. I've seen some people have little wall panels that will hold 20 decks or so, but how about something like a turning rack, like the racks for displaying CDs or a turning poster rack? If somebody could come up with some sort of system.
And now we have some place to display them and take them out, then the great question is: do I take them out of the box, or are they just sealed? Or do I always have to buy two decks - one to play with, one to keep sealed? I see people doing both.
However I have yet to see a really beautiful card collection display that goes beyond `decks in a drawer', or `decks on a wall', or `decks on a tabletop'. If you consider these cards art (and they are - the back designs and the front designs are art), how do you display this art? How do you put it in a frame, and how do you appreciate it? Do you put it in a shoebox and say "Here's my card collection"? Do you have it in a little wall display of 20 decks and say "Here are my 20 decks"?
What impact has crowdfunding like Kickstarter had on the custom playing card industry and collecting?
People feel part of the creation, and feel like they can be patrons of the art. It's like: "Oh, I can be part of this, I can be part of this creative process, I can be a co-collaborator." So that's a good thing that I'll say about it. People support what they help create, and people feel like they're helping create art. I think we need more people that are patrons of the arts. And playing cards is a very good way to share your wealth, and support other people's creative enterprises.
Do you recommend performing magicians get their own branded custom deck of playing cards?
Absolutely. But it depends on what impression you want to make. Some people like to use regular cards because they look very normal. I use my own cards because they're very special, and they have my name on them. If somebody looks at my cards, they'll say, "Wow, Jeff has his own brand of playing cards, he must be very good." You can drive a car, but you can design and manufacture your own car. Who do you deem more magical? Probably the person that's designed their own car.
And when I throw my cards into the audience, it's not the end of my show. It's the beginning of an adventure, because on the back the card it says: "Every card has a special meaning. To discover this card's secret, you have to go to my website." So now they have to go on this mysterious quest to find out the meaning of their card. It's a tarot information site. And when they get to my website after they catch one of my special cards, now they have an opportunity to pick an email address of a friend, and throw that card around the world to them. So I'm continuing the tradition that got me into magic; I'm throwing a card out and saying, "Here, pick this card." And they pick up that card in the audience, and hopefully it will take them on a magical adventure for the rest of their lives.
How many decks or cards have I gone through throughout the years? Tens of thousands. I go through at least two decks a show, for tens of thousands of shows.
Do you personally collect playing cards?
I'm not manic about it, but I collect good fanning decks. If a particular design of a more standard deck hits my radar, I'll pick it up. I like some of your decks, they're very beautiful.
Sometimes it's the box - it makes a statement. Sometimes the card box is the tuxedo for the cards. So the card box in my opinion has a lot to do with matching the performer's style and creating an aesthetic for the magical performance.
And it's even how you take the cards out of the box. If you read Roberto Giobbi's books, he's got very special ideas on how to remove the cards from the box, and how the box is put away. The Dean of the Mystery School teaches what he feels is the proper way to present a pack of cards out of your pocket, remove it from the deck gracefully, and place the box away. There are more refined ways to present a deck of cards to people than just tossing a box of cards on the table.
A deck of cards is a wonderful, mysterious, enchanting object. Fortunes are won and lost, and lives have come and gone on the turn of a single playing card. I live in Las Vegas, which is a town that was built on playing cards, divination systems, dice, and spinning wheels of fortune. Cards have an incredibly deep history and connection to mystery, and they're inherently very mysterious. So it's no wonder how people are attracted to their many different manifestations these days, whether it's a special box, or a back design, or a limited edition.

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Do you use playing cards for anything besides card magic and card manipulation?
I give very extensive workshops on the history of Tarot. We have an extraordinary collection of Tarot decks here, and also Tarot books. We also collected the greatest Tarot teachers from around the world to come and teach every year at the Las Vegas Tarot Summit.
Is there anything else you'd like to share?
I did an entire performance based on two cards. I did an off-Broadway show called Mask of the Mystic, and it was about two playing cards: the Magician card and the Fool card of the Tarot. I had originally designed an entire show around the Major Arcana of the Tarot cards back in the '80s, with a performance piece for each and every card. But the show was so dense with symbolism and meaning and complex, that I decided to keep it to just the first two cards. I played the Magician card, and a juggler named Michael Marlon played the Fool card, the innocent. There was a great dynamic between a trickster and an all too serious mage wizard character, and it was about the relationship between being blissfully ignorant, and being overly-fixated on the symbolism and meaning of magic.
That really sums up the experience with playing cards. Playing cards can be used for gambling. They can be used as a pastime to pass the time and play solitaire. They can be used for card magic. They can be used for cardistry. And for me, a deck of playing cards is a magic carpet that has taken me all over the world and has introduced me to incredible experiences, taken me to incredible places, and introduced me to all of the people I love most dearly in life.
So whether you're a fool just beginning your journey through the playing card story, or if you're at the end of your story as a wizard counting down your days, remember that there is a deck of playing cards - and perhaps a single playing card - that can change a person's life. So next time a person says "Pick a card," remember that this moment can change a life forever.

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CONCLUSION
It takes a lot for the Society of American Magicians to vote you into their Hall of Fame, especially when you're still active performing and teaching. Jeff McBride is one of the few in the world who can lay claim to being part of that select group.
Jeff is first and foremost a performer with a love for entertaining people, and the unique combination of elements that helps make his stage act stand out from other performers will always be a memorable trademark style that people associate with his name. But perhaps his lasting legacy will be the new role he has taken on as a sage and mentor to others. His Magic & Mystery School has been instrumental in producing new magicians who will continue to entertain us in years to come.
With this interview we've had a wonderful opportunity to have a glimpse of his thinking and learn about some of his experiences. Thank you Mr McBride for all that you've given to magic! May this inspire all of us to turn that pack of playing cards in our hands as a tool to develop our own skills, and to share our love for the arts with those around us!
Where to learn more? Check out Jeff McBride's resources here: - McBride Magic: Official site, promo video - Performance videos: Fool Us (2017), Masters of Illusion (2009), Masters of Illusion (2017) - Card manipulation: "Shaman Cards" performance, "King of Cards" performance - Magic & Mystery School: Official site, shop, Facebook - Social media: Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Youtube - Teaching resources: MagicFlix (code: MCBRIDE), Art of Card Manipulation DVDs, Essential Card Manipulation video

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Author's note: I first published this article at PlayingCardDecks here.
submitted by EndersGame_Reviewer to playingcards [link] [comments]

Interview with card manipulator Jeff McBride

Interview with card manipulator Jeff McBride
WHO IS JEFF MCBRIDE?
Chances are you are reading this article because you already have some interest in playing cards. So maybe you've already heard of the name Jeff McBride. If you have, you'll already be familiar with his credentials, so you'll be itching to get straight the good stuff and read what he's got to say, because you know it's going to be worth reading.
But if you haven't heard of Jeff McBride before, let me tell you why this interview is a must-read: ● Are you into card magic? Jeff has been doing card magic his whole life, and is one of the very best in the world at card manipulation and sleight of hand. He has also been running his famous Magic & Mystery School for over 30 years. ● Are you into cardistry? Jeff's instructional Art of Card Manipulation videos were some of the foundational materials that shaped fathers of the cardistry movement like Dan and Dave Buck. Card manipulation is his speciality, and if there's anyone that we can learn a thing or two about card handling from, it's him. ● Are you into card collecting? Jeff's entire career has been built with a deck of cards in his hands, and he also collects some playing card memorabilia himself.
So if you are a playing card enthusiast in any way, this is a wonderful opportunity to learn from one of the greatest living card men. We were delighted when Jeff agreed to do this interview with us, and couldn't wait to hear some of his thoughts about various topics relating to his own career with playing cards. We even got opportunity to visit him at his own place, and take some photos of his memorabilia and more, which we have permission to show our readers for the first time! But first let's share some of his credentials, so that we can appreciate what he has to say in the context of his own accomplishments and achievements.

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Jeff McBride the Performer
Jeff McBride has had a love for magic that goes back to his childhood in New York's Catskill mountains, where he grew up. As a young boy he stumbled across The Golden Book of Magic in a library, which quickly became his first magic Bible. He performed gigs locally, did street performances, and eventually moved to Las Vegas, where he successfully built a career in magic, and performs his award-winning stage magic and runs a magic school.
His performance style is highly praised for its unique blend of traditional magic with a form of Japanese theater called kabuki. Drawing on an unusual mix of skills that includes martial arts, philosophy, and more, Jeff's stage act combines an unorthodox blend of sleight of hand with masks and mime, to create a unique show like no other. Besides his "home" stage in Las Vegas, he's performed on stages and in theaters around the world, including touring with The Illusionists. A Jeff McBride show never fails to showcase his dynamic, innovative, and creative personality, from someone who has proven himself over time to be a master entertainer, showman, and sleight-of-hand artist.
Jeff McBride's list of awards is too lengthy to cover all of them. But to mention just a few, he's received recognition from exclusive and respected organizations, including "Magician of the Year" by The Magic Castle's The Academy of Magic Arts and "Magician of the Year" by the Society of American Magicians. In 2018 the International F?d?ration Internationale des Societes Magiques (FISM) gave him their "Theory & Philosophy Special Award", in tribute for his lifetime contribution to magic from a viewpoint that is analytical and academic. This illustrious award has previously been given only to Tommy Wonder, Juan Tamariz, Eugene Burger, and Roberto Giobbi. Most recently in January 2020 he was inducted into the prestigious Hall of Fame by the Society of American Magicians. He is part of a very small group of living magicians that are part of this exclusive club, which includes David Copperfield and Siegfried and Roy. He's even the holder of three world records - don't worry, we'll be sure to ask him about that in our interview!
And of course he has appeared on television many times, already back in 1995 as part of the "World's Greatest Magic, and more recently on shows like Masters of Illusion, Criss Angel's Mindfreak, and Penn & Teller's Fool Us. But he's not just "another magician", as his selection as a judge for the 2008 reality celebrity-magic show Celebradabra confirms. Already more than ten years ago filmmakers produced a documentary about him, entitled Jeff McBride: A Magickal Life. This has been highly praised by magicians and viewers for how it shows his journey from a boy magician to a headline act in Las Vegas, and also his personal spiritual journey and development from a brash young man into a mature and caring magician who is keen to pass on the art of magic to the next generation. He really is one of the best.
Jeff McBride the Teacher
While the first part of his career was all about performing in his inimitable style, as the years have passed Jeff McBride has more and more mellowed into a highly respected teacher, with a keen interest in sharing his wisdom with others, and helping young magicians develop their skills in magic. Besides many written works, he's produced best-selling and highly influential instructional videos on the art of card manipulation, and on stage magic. His current passion is to serve as a sage that helps other magicians make their dreams as performers come true.
Perhaps his crowning achievement and lasting legacy is the McBride Magic & Mystery School, which he established in 1991. This is a world-renowned training ground for stage magic, and is generally regarded as the very best and most prestigious institution in the world for receiving magic instruction. There's simply no better place for aspiring magicians to go, in order to take seminars, classes, and workshops, to help raise their magic to a higher level, and to learn the true secrets of the craft.
Highly respected magician and lecturer Eugene Burger (pictured below with Jeff McBride) served as Dean of this school until his sad passing in 2017. It was from him that Jeff learned the importance of burning one end of your own candle in order to light someone else's candle. Many leading magicians have served on the faculty or as guest instructors, including big names like Lance Burton, Johnny Thompson, and Max Maven.
Jeff McBride is a wonderful entertainer himself, but his current passion is to be a mentor to others, and he will leave a lasting stamp in the lives of many magicians of the future. But now it's time for us to sit at his feet, and learn a thing or two from his life, and about his experiences with playing cards in particular.

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THE INTERVIEW
GENERAL BACKGROUND
For those who don't know anything about you, what can you tell us about yourself and your background?
I started my career with a pack of playing cards. Now I headline Las Vegas shows, and theaters and festivals all over the world. I also run a very successful magic school in Las Vegas, and I teach online.
I am one of the first magic teachers to create a video series, and my breakthrough videos on card manipulation taught the world how to perform flourishes and card manipulation, which happened to grow into a new cardistry movement. I was fortunate enough to train with great old-school masters and I put out The Art of Card Manipulation which caught on in Asia. The material contained within those DVDs - they were VHS videos at that time - did not need words to understand how to perform the magic, so they had international appeal. Many people like An Ha Lim and leading Asian manipulators found these, and my videos were their original training tools.
What would be some of the highlights in your career in magic?
Performing at Radio City Music Hall, the largest theater in the world with no screen support, no image magnification, and performing my card manipulation routine. The only other person that had that experience was Cardini. That was one of the highlights.
And of course, being inducted into the Society of American Magicians Hall of Fame. Also winning the FISM Special Award for Theory and Philosophy was a highlight. That's an award I share with Tommy Wonder, Juan Tamariz, and Eugene Burger.
How would you describe the style of the amazing act that you are known for?
I call it "sorcerer" style, which is very fiery and dynamic. There are many types of card routines, and mine is very explosive and dynamic. In fact during my touring seasons with the hit show The Illusionists, the closing number of the show was my card routine, just before the snow storm sequence. So my card routine can fill a giant theater. At that time of The Illusionists we were working a 7,000 seat theater. So my motto was "pack small, play big."
What were your major influences for this style of performance?
My influences came from many directions. I realized early on that performing standard magic was not a path to success. It was a path to working weddings, bar mitzvahs and birthday parties. In order to break out, I had to become a much more dynamic performer and I added other skillsets I had studied, like classic pantomime theater, which I'd studied at the American Mime Theater. I combined martial arts and my passion for masks and quick change, and dance. And it was this fusion of all of these different theatrical elements that made a huge difference. It was much more than magic, it was a total theatrical experience.
Where can people go to see you perform today?
I teach magic on a platform called MagicFlix. There's performances and tutorials. It's the world's leading streaming platform for magic. So you can immediately see me there. If you want to trial it, all you have to do is go to MagicFlix's website, enter your information, and put in the code MCBRIDE, and you can get 30 days for free. You can see not only myself, but the great masters of magic, and some of the great card magicians in history, as well as learn my card manipulation sequences.
Also if you want to see my live shows, I perform in Las Vegas at Wonderground, which is the longest running independent variety magic show in the history of Las Vegas. It is not attached to a casino, so we can do some pretty wild stuff! That's been running 11 years, and has hosted more variety entertainers on its stage than any other stage in Las Vegas.
What should we know about the McBride Magic & Mystery School, which has now been running for around 30 years?
It's now over 30 years. The McBride Magic and Mystery School came out of a great desire to study with masters. The challenge I see these days is that most people are learning magic from their peers, from people in their own age group. And not necessarily looking up the ladder at masters that have achieved great amounts of success.
So what I did 30 years ago, is I decided to host a retreat for masters to come and teach hungry students, mostly professionals, that were willing to empty their cup and fill up on wisdom and on the experience of great masters. And over the years we've had Eugene Burger, Johnny Thompson, Max Maven and many, many other masters come to the school to help our students understand the path to mastery. So not just learning from your pals online or at magic class, but really top-down training from experts in the field.
What are some of your interests outside of magic?
I spend a lot of time going to other conferences learning more skills on how to facilitate life-transforming experiences. So I spend a lot of time still studying how to teach more effectively, both in person and online.

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PLAYING CARDS & CARD MANIPULATION
You have set several Guinness World Records. What can you tell us about these?
I have three Guinness World Records, two of them for coin rolling, and one of them for card spinning. My Guinness World Record certificate states that I was able to "single handedly spin or scale a record of 106 playing cards within 60 seconds." That was set in 2004 for speed, for card throwing.
You are known for your skill in card manipulation. How would you distinguish magic from cardistry?
When they're fused together, they're indistinguishable, because of the flow state. Here are some flourishes, here are some card tricks - I think it can be seamlessly blended together. When I watch young cardists out there, I'm just amazed by the things that I see them doing these days. I'm totally delighted, and it's magical for me. Magicians that call cardistry "juggling" are just not getting what it's about. It's about entering a flow state, mastering these series of moves, and then pushing the envelope, until you have many of these different flourishes that you can string together seamlessly. That's the elegance of it.
What is one piece of work you have released that you'd like to be remembered by, or which might be of interest to the playing card enthusiast?
Anybody that watches Jeff McBride The Art of Card Manipulation will see how I researched all of the old school material and the stuff that I'd learned in my generation, and put it all together in one place. Those are the videos that the Buck twins - Dave and Dan - saw. Many of the people that first started card manipulation and cardistry saw me on those World's Greatest Magic specials back in the '90s that were filmed at Caesar's Palace. This was one of the first modern versions of card manipulation on TV.
So I think my series on The Art of Card Manipulation imprinted a lot of young magicians, young card handlers, and then the cardistry movement. I was not singularly responsible for that, but The Art of Card Manipulation was definitely essential fuel for it, because it was the most comprehensive card manipulation series ever put out.

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What advice would you give to a young person just starting to learn card magic or card manipulation?
Learn from your pals, but study in person with a great master. It will shave years off your learning curve.
Do you have any thoughts about the current boom in cardistry, and how this has become immensely popular in recent years?
The deck of cards is a great equalizer, isn't it? Here you have 52 objects, and now all you have to do is add your creativity and countless hours of practice and commitment to perfection. It's not like you can buy it. Acquiring the next magic illusion is quite different than acquiring the next impossible flourish with cards. You just can't do it, it has to come from the heart and soul. That's why I think cardistry became such a phenomenon. It doesn't have any language barriers, cultural barriers, or status barriers. All that separates one from being average or great is the commitment to perfection, artistry, and beauty.
What brand/type playing cards did you first use when you started magic and card manipulation?
I used every card I could get my hands on. There were bridge-size decks for card fanning that would have four different colors or four different patterns, so you could get the different color fans out of them. Really good fanning decks are sorely lacking today; I very rarely see any of these new decks being good fanning decks. But I would collect every thin card I could possibly find at that time. Very few people at that time were making flesh colored cards. Sometimes you had to strip cards down, and then paint them flesh colored, and use lots of powder to make them fan again.
Early on I used Crusaders, because in my teens that's what Jeff Sheridan was using, so I used Crusaders that you could get at Woolworth's. Bee cards are okay, but when they reach a certain age they just crack. A lot of the `old school' used and swore by the old Denver Plaids and the old Steamboats. So when I was in my tens and early teens (11-15 years old), there was a lot of Steamboats, and in my later teens I used Crusaders.
What brand/type playing cards do you mostly use today?
I switched over to my own brand, when I had my own cards printed by Phoenix (my cards are available on my site here). Phoenix really pays attention to their cutting and I'm very fond of Phoenix brand cards published by Christian Schenk from Card-Shark.
What do you think are the essential qualities of a good deck of playing cards?
The ability to fan them out of the pack, and their ability to faro shuffle. Those are the two prime ingredients. That they don't need fanning powder. That they're not too slippery, so you don't have to work with them too long to get the finish off, and that they faro well. I'm mostly a stage performer, and I do close up as well. I love some of the decks that you have, with the very whimsical face designs. But for me it's the way the cards handle more than the way they look.
Has the quality of playing cards has improved over the years?
Oh, absolutely. Absolutely the quality has improved over the years. The finishes these days and the deck designs are just incredible.

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What are your thoughts on the explosion of custom playing cards that we are seeing today?
For me personally, I don't see enough nice fanning decks. I would collect them, but they're not out there.
I think the next step for card collectors is: how do you store and display them? The serious person will start to make floor to ceiling displays for walls of cards with a giant ladder, like a library so you can have these decks on display. I've seen some people have little wall panels that will hold 20 decks or so, but how about something like a turning rack, like the racks for displaying CDs or a turning poster rack? If somebody could come up with some sort of system.
And now we have some place to display them and take them out, then the great question is: do I take them out of the box, or are they just sealed? Or do I always have to buy two decks - one to play with, one to keep sealed? I see people doing both.
However I have yet to see a really beautiful card collection display that goes beyond `decks in a drawer', or `decks on a wall', or `decks on a tabletop'. If you consider these cards art (and they are - the back designs and the front designs are art), how do you display this art? How do you put it in a frame, and how do you appreciate it? Do you put it in a shoebox and say "Here's my card collection"? Do you have it in a little wall display of 20 decks and say "Here are my 20 decks"?
What impact has crowdfunding like Kickstarter had on the custom playing card industry and collecting?
People feel part of the creation, and feel like they can be patrons of the art. It's like: "Oh, I can be part of this, I can be part of this creative process, I can be a co-collaborator." So that's a good thing that I'll say about it. People support what they help create, and people feel like they're helping create art. I think we need more people that are patrons of the arts. And playing cards is a very good way to share your wealth, and support other people's creative enterprises.
Do you recommend performing magicians get their own branded custom deck of playing cards?
Absolutely. But it depends on what impression you want to make. Some people like to use regular cards because they look very normal. I use my own cards because they're very special, and they have my name on them. If somebody looks at my cards, they'll say, "Wow, Jeff has his own brand of playing cards, he must be very good." You can drive a car, but you can design and manufacture your own car. Who do you deem more magical? Probably the person that's designed their own car.
And when I throw my cards into the audience, it's not the end of my show. It's the beginning of an adventure, because on the back the card it says: "Every card has a special meaning. To discover this card's secret, you have to go to my website." So now they have to go on this mysterious quest to find out the meaning of their card. It's a tarot information site. And when they get to my website after they catch one of my special cards, now they have an opportunity to pick an email address of a friend, and throw that card around the world to them. So I'm continuing the tradition that got me into magic; I'm throwing a card out and saying, "Here, pick this card." And they pick up that card in the audience, and hopefully it will take them on a magical adventure for the rest of their lives.
How many decks or cards have I gone through throughout the years? Tens of thousands. I go through at least two decks a show, for tens of thousands of shows.
Do you personally collect playing cards?
I'm not manic about it, but I collect good fanning decks. If a particular design of a more standard deck hits my radar, I'll pick it up. I like some of your decks, they're very beautiful.
Sometimes it's the box - it makes a statement. Sometimes the card box is the tuxedo for the cards. So the card box in my opinion has a lot to do with matching the performer's style and creating an aesthetic for the magical performance.
And it's even how you take the cards out of the box. If you read Roberto Giobbi's books, he's got very special ideas on how to remove the cards from the box, and how the box is put away. The Dean of the Mystery School teaches what he feels is the proper way to present a pack of cards out of your pocket, remove it from the deck gracefully, and place the box away. There are more refined ways to present a deck of cards to people than just tossing a box of cards on the table.
A deck of cards is a wonderful, mysterious, enchanting object. Fortunes are won and lost, and lives have come and gone on the turn of a single playing card. I live in Las Vegas, which is a town that was built on playing cards, divination systems, dice, and spinning wheels of fortune. Cards have an incredibly deep history and connection to mystery, and they're inherently very mysterious. So it's no wonder how people are attracted to their many different manifestations these days, whether it's a special box, or a back design, or a limited edition.

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Do you use playing cards for anything besides card magic and card manipulation?
I give very extensive workshops on the history of Tarot. We have an extraordinary collection of Tarot decks here, and also Tarot books. We also collected the greatest Tarot teachers from around the world to come and teach every year at the Las Vegas Tarot Summit.
Is there anything else you'd like to share?
I did an entire performance based on two cards. I did an off-Broadway show called Mask of the Mystic, and it was about two playing cards: the Magician card and the Fool card of the Tarot. I had originally designed an entire show around the Major Arcana of the Tarot cards back in the '80s, with a performance piece for each and every card. But the show was so dense with symbolism and meaning and complex, that I decided to keep it to just the first two cards. I played the Magician card, and a juggler named Michael Marlon played the Fool card, the innocent. There was a great dynamic between a trickster and an all too serious mage wizard character, and it was about the relationship between being blissfully ignorant, and being overly-fixated on the symbolism and meaning of magic.
That really sums up the experience with playing cards. Playing cards can be used for gambling. They can be used as a pastime to pass the time and play solitaire. They can be used for card magic. They can be used for cardistry. And for me, a deck of playing cards is a magic carpet that has taken me all over the world and has introduced me to incredible experiences, taken me to incredible places, and introduced me to all of the people I love most dearly in life.
So whether you're a fool just beginning your journey through the playing card story, or if you're at the end of your story as a wizard counting down your days, remember that there is a deck of playing cards - and perhaps a single playing card - that can change a person's life. So next time a person says "Pick a card," remember that this moment can change a life forever.

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CONCLUSION
It takes a lot for the Society of American Magicians to vote you into their Hall of Fame, especially when you're still active performing and teaching. Jeff McBride is one of the few in the world who can lay claim to being part of that select group.
Jeff is first and foremost a performer with a love for entertaining people, and the unique combination of elements that helps make his stage act stand out from other performers will always be a memorable trademark style that people associate with his name. But perhaps his lasting legacy will be the new role he has taken on as a sage and mentor to others. His Magic & Mystery School has been instrumental in producing new magicians who will continue to entertain us in years to come.
With this interview we've had a wonderful opportunity to have a glimpse of his thinking and learn about some of his experiences. Thank you Mr McBride for all that you've given to magic! May this inspire all of us to turn that pack of playing cards in our hands as a tool to develop our own skills, and to share our love for the arts with those around us!
Where to learn more? Check out Jeff McBride's resources here: - McBride Magic: Official site, promo video - Performance videos: Fool Us (2017), Masters of Illusion (2009), Masters of Illusion (2017) - Card manipulation: "Shaman Cards" performance, "King of Cards" performance - Magic & Mystery School: Official site, shop, Facebook - Social media: Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Youtube - Teaching resources: MagicFlix (code: MCBRIDE), Art of Card Manipulation DVDs, Essential Card Manipulation video

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Author's note: I first published this article at PlayingCardDecks here.
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In 1988, Jessica Arredondo was abducted and murdered in the Denver area. Is a convicted killer responsible for her death?

In November 1988, Jessica Arrendondo, 21, was an operator at the U.S. West phone company. She had graduated from Abraham Lincoln High School a couple of years ago, where she played soccer, served on the student senate, and captained the school’s cheerleading squad. Perhaps it’s because it was the 1980s and Jessica loved dancing, but her pictures bring to mind the actress Jennifer Beals of Flashdance fame. At the time of her murder, Jessica was living at home with her parents and her beloved dog Frosty.
She also loved her new car, an eye-catching red 1988 Mustang convertible. According to her family, she had saved money for months and months, and the car was her pride and joy. She kept it in immaculate condition, and the car had a personalized license plate that read “88 PONY.”
Friday, November 25, 1988, was the day after Thanksgiving. Jessica and her boyfriend hopped in her car and headed towards Glendale, Colorado, a municipality in the southern part of metropolitan Denver. On the way, they had a minor disagreement. She dropped him off at Neil’s, a bar in Glendale, and drove away. It was the last time he would see her.
At 11:25 PM, Jessica’s Mustang was found abandoned with its blinkers on at E. 7th and Jackson Street, a few blocks from Neil’s. When police inspected the scene, they noticed there was damage to the exterior of the car as if a minor accident had occurred. Witnesses reported that Jessica had been kidnapped from the site by multiple men, and at least one article mentions that two cars were involved. Police suspected that someone had crashed into her car intentionally as a ruse to get her to pull over and then abducted her.
On Saturday afternoon, two passersby were playing in the snow along U.S. 36 in Larrimer County and found a nude body about 50 feet from the road. This area is north of Denver, close to Rocky Mountain National Park, and approximately a 1.5 hour drive from where Jessica’s car was abandoned. The autopsy later revealed Jessica had died from blunt force trauma to the head. Although one article in the Denver Post stated there were no signs of sexual assault, a later article in the Fort Collins Coloradoan clarified that investigators believe she was sexually assaulted, although there is no forensic evidence proving so. Some reports state that the trauma to Jessica’s body may have been from her jumping from a moving vehicle, but this is merely speculation. Jessica’s clothes were recovered scattered along the highway near where her body was found.
At the scene, law enforcement found tire tracks indicating someone had backed up a vehicle and dumped Jessica’s body down an embankment. The other notable clue was not one, but two sets of footprints in the snow near the body, consistent with witnesses’ assertions that there were multiple men at the scene of her abduction.
Despite composite sketches of two of the men seen at the accident scene, law enforcement never named any suspects. Jessica’s case soon went cold.
Another Murder, Five Years Later
On February 12, 1994, Rhonda Maloney, 25, finished her shift as a waitress at Harrah’s Casino in Central City and headed towards her home in Adams County. Robert Eliot Harlan, 29, pulled his car alongside hers and ran her off the road near the intersection of I-76 and I-25. Once she had stopped the car, Harlan threatened Maloney with a gun. He dragged her from the car and proceeded to rape her repeatedly.
Mother of three Jaquie Creazzo was on her way to pick up her father around 5:45 AM. The sun had not yet risen, but in the darkness she noticed the two cars haphazardly on the side of the ramp to northbound I-25, one with blinkers on. She slowed down and caught a glimpse of a blonde woman fleeing one of the cars; the terrified expression on her face made Creazzo come to a complete stop. Maloney ran to Creazzo’s car and jumped in, telling her she’d been run off the road and then raped for hours by a man with a gun.
Creazzo immediately headed toward the local police station. Harlan had not given up; he was in hot pursuit, and a dangerous chase ensued on the icy road. Harlan pulled alongside Creazzo’s Cadillac and fired several rounds into the driver’s side, hitting Creazzo in her face, knee, and spine. She tried to steer but she lost control, crossed the median, and came to a stop on the lawn of her destination, the Thornton Police station. Behind the wheel, Creazzo was still conscious but covered in blood, unable to move and spitting out teeth. Harlan appeared, telling Creazzo not to tell anyone about Maloney, saying he would find her and kill her if she did. She watched helplessly as Harlan pulled Maloney from the passenger’s seat and sped off.
Creazzo would later tell the Los Angeles Times, “Being paralyzed is a small price to pay to get this person, actually if you want to call him a person, off the street.”
Creazzo provided police with a description of the perpetrator and the car, helping to generate leads. In the meantime, Darryl Harlan, Robert’s brother, had seen reports about Maloney’s murder on the news and he made a horrific realization. Robert had shown up at Darryl’s house at 8 AM the morning of the murder, wearing bloody sweatpants. Darryl asked Robert if he had vomited on himself. That morning, Robert left his bloody clothes and an unloaded gun at his brother’s house. On February 15th, Darryl approached their father, a Denver police detective, and shared his suspicions. Detective Belt Harlan Jr. bagged the items his son Robert had left at his son Darryl’s house. According to Darryl, the two of them then broke down and cried at the realization of what Robert may have done. Detective Harlan then took the bagged items directly to Denver Police Chief David Michaud, and Robert Harlan was arrested that day.
Harlan was in custody, but Maloney was still missing and Harlan provided the cops with no new information. Maloney’s purse was recovered by the side of a road. A local Aurora man who saw a news report about the recovered purse and the ongoing search believed the cops were searching in the wrong place. A San Francisco Examiner article entitled, “Amateur sleuth locates body in record time,” describes how Loyal Burner mapped out the area and initiated his own search. Although police had been searching for a week, Burner found Rhonda Maloney’s nude body in 1 ½ hours near the town of Watkins, east of Denver.
Maloney’s autopsy revealed she had been severely beaten, with several fractures to her skull, and had injuries consistent with sexual assault. Cause of death was determined to be a gunshot to the head.
The Suspect
Given the similarities in M.O., law enforcement in Larimer County named Harlan a suspect in Jessica Arredondo’s abduction and murder.
At first glance, Robert Harlan may have seemed like an unlikely perpetrator. He had stable employment. He was the son of a Denver police detective and seemed to have solid family ties. Indeed, both his brother and his father testified in his defense during the sentencing phase of his trial.
But even a brief look into Harlan’s past revealed a history of harassment and violence against women. The Grand Junction Daily Sentinel reported that Harlan was on parole and in a sex offender program at the time of the murder. Although I could not determine what precipitated this sentence, a separate article mentioned he had been arrested for using a stun gun on his then-wife. The month before he killed Rhonda Maloney, a psychologist who had been treating Harlan for a year wrote letters to Harlan’s probation officer and a judge, recommending that he be supervised more closely because he was a danger to the community. Harlan had a parole revocation hearing scheduled two days after Maloney was killed.
A second rather damning fact was that Harlan was working as an operator at U.S. West, where Jessica Arredondo had worked. In fact, he had been in that position for eight years and had worked alongside Jessica. Harlan’s history at work soon grabbed headlines, as the Maloney trial galvanized 39 women who had worked at U.S. West to hire a lawyer and seek a $22 million settlement. They claimed Harlan made lewd comments, touched them inappropriately, and harassed them, creating a hostile and un unsafe work environment. At one point, he brought a gun to work. He stalked one of his co-workers, and she obtained a restraining order against him. The women claimed their fear of Harlan escalated after Arredondo’s disappearance, yet U.S. West never took action against Harlan.
The Only Suspect?
Larimer County Sheriff’s Department investigator John Toppenberg was quoted in the news during the Maloney trial. The judge excluded any evidence about the Arrendondo murder during the Maloney trial. Regarding Harlan, Toppenberg claimed “He is our only suspect. He is our prime suspect. It is our view that he killed Jessica Arrendondo.” To this day, no other suspects have been named.
If you recall, however, there were two sets of footprints where Jessica’s body was found. Another article also states that not one, but two cars were observed driving her off the road the night she went missing, and that police believed three men were involved; two composite sketches were released to the press. Harlan may be the only suspect they have identified, but it seems he is not the only suspect involved.
Harlan’s Fate
On June 20, 1995, Harlan was found guilty of Maloney’s kidnapping, rape, and murder, as well as the attempted murder of Jaquie Creazzo. In September, he was sentenced to death by lethal injection. At the time Harlan was sentenced, no one had been executed in Colorado since 1967, and only a couple of men were on death row. Gary Lee Davis was executed in 1997, however, and for crimes similar to Harlan’s: the kidnapping, rape, and murder of Virginia Ray. Given the governor had refused to grant Davis clemency, this likely raised Harlan’s fear that he too may be put to death. He appealed his convictions and the sentence, filing several briefs about voir dire, the suitability of various jurors, whether or not a change of venue was warranted, instructions given to jurors, and other typical appeals that were all denied.
In 2003, Harlan again appealed his death sentence. This time, the filing had teeth. Jurors had brought Bibles into the jury room while deliberating his sentence in 1995, considering passages such as the oft-quoted “eye for an eye” during the discussion. It is against state law for jurors to consider outside materials irrelevant to the case during deliberation. (Further, it seems wildly inappropriate and unconstitutional to weigh a particular religion’s belief in such a determination.) In a 3-2 decision, the Colorado Supreme Court ruled this was a violation of Harlan’s rights. Because this happened during the sentencing phase, not the guilt phase, his conviction was upheld but his sentence was overturned. The U.S. Supreme Court later refused to reinstate the death sentence for Harlan.
Other victims?
One article noted that there are over 35 unsolved homicides of young women in the Denver area in between 1975 and 1995, a period which would have included Harlan’s viable killing years. There are several young women who were murdered and found nude by roadsides preceding and following Arredondo’s death. Because both Arrendondo’s and Maloney’s deaths do not adhere to a clear pattern—the first seemingly a gang rape and murder, the second interrupted by Jacquie Creazzo’s heroic act—I think it is difficult to assign a complete MO to Harlan or to know how he would have behaved without the interference of others. I assume Harlan’s DNA is in CODIS, but it is unclear whether DNA from these various cold cases (or Jessica's, for that matter) has been processed.
Do you think Harlan was involved in the killing of Jessica Arredondo?
A very long shot, but do you know of any perpetrators in the Denver area at the time that could have been involved in Jessica's disappearance (either ties to Harlan or similar MO)?
Do you think Harlan is a serial killer? Are there other cases you think Harlan is a good match for?
If you have any information on abduction and murder of Jessica Arredondo, please contact the Larimer County Sheriff’s Office at Larimer County Sheriff's Department at 1 (970) 498-5100.
Sources
https://apps.colorado.gov/apps/coldcase/casedetail.html?id=1425
http://blogs.denverpost.com/coldcases/2010/07/25/killers-rammed-car-kidnapped-young-woman-and-tossed-body/1637/3/
https://www.pomc.com/mw_stories_1-19/jessica_arredondo.html
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1994-11-20-mn-64850-story.html
https://www.denverpost.com/2005/12/19/killer-harlan-gets-life-without-parole/
https://caselaw.findlaw.com/co-supreme-court/1026772.html
Newspaper sources (sorry, no links)
“Suspect has history of sex offenses,” Daily Sentinel. February 18, 1994
“Amateur sleuth locates body in record time,” San Francisco Examiner. February 21, 1994
“Kidnap-murder link strong,” Daily Sentinel. February 22, 1994
“Results of autopsy on slain waitress won’t be given until suspect’s hearing,” Daily Sentinel. February 23, 1994
“Harlan suspected in ’88 slaying,” Fort Collins Coloradoan. June 24, 1995.
“Murderer’s policeman father expected to be final witness,” Daily Sentinel. June 28, 1995
“Harlan sentenced to death in murder,” Fort Collins Coloradoan. July 2, 1995
“Killer’s former co-workers plan suit,” Daily Sentinel. July 6, 1995
EDIT: Changed spelling of Jaquie Creazzo's name. Although it also appears as "Jacquie" in several places, I switched to the spelling in the legal document.
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